Angel
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 Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 9:16 pm
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| What I've never really understood about Christianity is the God-Devil thing.
I mean, if Satan was sent from the heavens down to hell for going against god and being all evil and such, why does he torment people that follow suit? I'd think he'd praise them for doing so.
Ya' know, defying the one he obviously hates. XD
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Catghost
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Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 9:21 pm
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| We are created in the image of God and even though we have sinned, he still loves us. I am unsure how to word this correctly, but why would he praise the creatures God loves the most? He would hate us, just like he hates God.
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Angel
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Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 9:23 pm
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| But if we did things so revolting in God's eyes that he would cast us down to the level where Satan is, why would he still torture us? D:
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_________________
"Women don't want to hear a man's opinion. They just want to hear their opinion in a deeper voice." - Jeff Foxworthy
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Catghost
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Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 9:26 pm
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| Do you mean tortured in Hell or what?
If you mean hell, then I don't know since I don't really believe in the fire and brimstone hell where you are tortured for eternity or whatever..
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Urboros
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Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 8:57 am
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| I have a problem with the alleged origonal sin, God preformed the number one thing you don't do wuth kids, adults, and any other thing that can understand speech. I know I babysit you never say "don't do this" for thats the first thing anyone is going to do. Also God let the devil in his garden....not really an eden if something so evil can gain acess to it.
The story seems that god is setting man kind up for failure. :/
I don't like that in a religion where we have been set up, and then have to live a life of repentance  its like your innocent but you were thrown into jail anyways...
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tigerangel
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Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 9:05 am
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| I was raised in a strict Catholic upbringing. Going to church on Sundays and Catechism on Saturday was a given, not a choice as I was growing up.
When I reached adulthood, I was happy to have the freedom to explore other religions. I have found a few that are much less formal and controlling that the Catholic church is.
I believe that there is a God, as much as I believe that everything you do and everyone you meet, happens for a reason.
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Catghost
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Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 10:30 am
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| Urboros wrote: |
I have a problem with the alleged origonal sin, God preformed the number one thing you don't do wuth kids, adults, and any other thing that can understand speech. I know I babysit you never say "don't do this" for thats the first thing anyone is going to do. Also God let the devil in his garden....not really an eden if something so evil can gain acess to it.
The story seems that god is setting man kind up for failure. :/
I don't like that in a religion where we have been set up, and then have to live a life of repentance its like your innocent but you were thrown into jail anyways... |
The way I saw it was,
God was testing their faith(or something of that nature), as they(Adam&Eve) knew what would happen if they ate the fruit. They knew full well what would happen but they did it anyway.
"Satan" was tempting them, telling them they would be like gods, etc. if they ate it. Even though they already knew what would happen if they did.
So yeah, God allowed Satan into the garden, told them not to eat the fruit, satan tells them if they eat it they will become gods etc.(even though they knew they wouldn't), they eat it anyway and thus, the original sin.
But I'm not a bible scholar or anything so don't quote me on that. 
(I don't see how you think we where set up? God already knew we would sin even if he didn't "set us up")
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Catghost
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Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 10:44 am
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| Angel wrote: |
But if we did things so revolting in God's eyes that he would cast us down to the level where Satan is, why would he still torture us? D: |
I thought about this last night, and I think I can answer that for you.
In essence you "burn in hell" for eternity, from the flames etc.? That is what happens when you sin I guess, eternal death. Or in this case "eternal suffering". Satan cannot stop that, he cannot stop the suffering because that is what happens when you sin..
But I don't think you suffer for an eternity (Or at least, it won't be for an eternity.), since the "hell" of today(eternal suffering in flames), correct me if I'm wrong, came about recently or at least after the Bible was completed.
What I've gotten from studying the bible is that you get tossed into hell, (your soul is already dead so how can you suffer?) So your soul it destroyed in hell, and you become nothingness.
*Not saying this like it's a fact* XD
So I could be wrong.
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Kira Bella
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Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:48 am
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| Being an agnostic my self, I feel you on the wanting to know more about other religions. Personally, the most interesting religion in my mind would be Wiccan (If you can consider that a religion. Always thought of it more as a lifestyle). Mainly because I used to date a few young ladies that held that particular religion deep to their hearts.
I fell in love with the rules, and the secrets of it all. I my self could never do it, being so... lets say, easily distracted. xD But I think people who have religions that are like that, ones that take months of learning, and a life time to prefect, are just wonderful. I dont have the drive or the ambition to devote my life to soething that I believe so strongly in. I mean, I am all for animals rights, and that everyone should have the ability to live their own lives as they want, but that is... me. xD Not really a life changing statment..
As for practiced religions.. I have tried, and failed, to be christian, Wiccan, and just recently, I wanted to try the religion of Hindu. Apperently my mind is too clouded for me to even try, but that is find with me. I love their culture anyway <3
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Urboros
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Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 12:03 pm
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| yeas the whole God knowing that we wouldn't listen and still going ahead with it (its called bad parenting in real life), why would God do that?
Maybe God got in a feud with Zeus and used us as an example. D:
Not ment to attack or anything, but I like the bible as a fable book with little morals behind each story (some of the old testment stuff doesn't have morals) the story of eden included because I can't decide if the man and women were before or after the dinosaur era...
I'm a roman catholic and I don't beleve in most of the stuff besides love.
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Catghost
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Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 2:53 pm
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| God told them not to eat the fruit, but they did it anyway. What did God do that would be the equivalent of bad parenting?
It's like a parent telling their child if they mess with a dog, it will bite them. The child knows this, but continues to pester the dog anyway until it does bites them.
Unless you where asking why God let them eat the fruit in the first place..?
If thats what you meant, then it's because God gave them a choice, and they chose to eat fruit.
They could have been during or after the time of the dinosaurs, I always though after when I had read about God wiping out "monsters" when they where expelled from eden. But I don't know, it's been so long since I read that. -__-;
What I think is that the bible has lots of metaphors in the stories, but they are still true and that they did happen.. which is probably why I get annoyed at people who think everything in the bible is literal. (like the 7 days of Creation, and hell :p)
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Urboros
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Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 9:24 pm
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| Okay^^ That sounds better... I was a bit focused on god knowing we'd fail to listen. Cause I wouldn't have eaten the apple since I don't care for them <.< yeah I forgot a bout the free will bit in the eden story.
bad parenting telling the kid not to do something knowing their natural curoisity will impead their judgement and do exactly what the parent forbad. sometimes bad parents will forbid something knowing this and getting satisfaction for the pain the kid endure (very few, my ex aunt for example).
:3 convinced me
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MaxR
Programmer
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Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 1:32 pm
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| Question myself now
why would he let satan live anyway and tempt people. Temptation is a seperate force itself that acts upon us. And people are always being tempted to do wrong....
So without satan, and still having free will, no one would want to do anything wrong, or do marginally less things wrong
so why would he let the devil stay.
also, how come if two people(adam and eve) screw up, we have to?
thats like your mom and dad robbed a bank, and you have to pay the losses, which shouldn't happen because your innocent
I don't see where the sin's have to carry down to innocent people.
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Catghost
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Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 2:39 pm
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| Satan was not in the garden, I confused myself again.. It was a serpent. Not satan.
I must remember that. >_<
How can you say we are innocent? We all are guilty, look at yourself, your friends, your family and then tell me we are innocent.
They sinned, and now it is in mankind's nature to sin.
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Urboros
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Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 3:08 pm
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| Oh the serpent in western religions represents satan, metaphorically. In eastern religions the serpen is a sign of fertility, eath and good things. I'm not sure why there are two different veiws on our poor leg-less friend...but I'm more incline to belive that the western world need something to reject of the eastern part...and the snake suffered.
:_;
hey when your born as a baby one is innocent right? I gess growing up is a sin D: I want to go to never land!
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