Religion And Sexuality

[Afanassii]

This is a bit of a conundrum to me.

Its hard to have an opinion on homosexuality when you are intersexed.

The divisions between the sexes are not absolute and, thus, there is no point in denying any combination of genders in a relationship.

Intersexualism and homosexuality exist in nature so we know that its not necessarily a choice even with humans who do have the ability to choose with most things.

Though, what I do see is that human beings will always form themselves into groups and those groups will squabble over what is OK and what is not. It doesn't surprise me that homosexuality is among this, however I think any sort of discriminatory actions are wrong.

Are there religious rules concerning those of us who are neither male nor female? From what I've seen, there generally aren't. I believe that this is because acknowledging that male and female genders are not always clear-cut and black and white would be to acknowledge the fallacy in denying anyone the right to love in their own way.

[Transcendence]

Wow Jaime, I never thought of life that way, but I can understand how that might be true. I mean your gender is not really something you can measure one way or the other. I mean you might be able to physically determine your gender, but there are other parts that determine what you are and what you like.

Honestly though, while I am not bisexual, lesbian, or any other deviation of those, I think that it is wrong to think badly or treat anyone badly because of what they believe. Additionally I think it is none of my business what other people do. I dont judge people any differently because of their sexuality.

[Rawien]

Reply to BerlinHawk

But I don't understand, why do you feel that segragating the person and discriminating against the person in any way showing compassion for them? I feel that is hurting the person in much more of a way than they could possibly hurt themselves.

But how can loving someone be hurtful to themselves?

[Berlin]

Just so you know, I don't discriminate. I am good friends both online and in real life with bisexuals and gays. I love them as people. But I feel what they are doing is sinful and unnatural. I may sometimes feel uncomfortable around those people when I learn that. But I mean. It's the same exact feeling I get when I find out someone is doing something else sinful or illegal. I don't discriminate, but try to become a better friend. To see if I can help them. I don't go outright and say they are awful people for doing whatever. I become close to them and wait until they are willing to give up whatever.

You can love someone of the same gender. I love all of my friends and would do anything for them. But that doesn't mean that I will go out of my way to kiss and/or sleep with them.

I love my cat. That doesn't mean I MAKE love to my cat.

[x_lilmissNINJA_x]

What I think we should all try to understand is that:

1. The world changes, so do people. So do ideas, so do situations. The bible chooses not to change, but people do. So, therefore, is the bible inaccurate to today's standards?

2. We chose to be whoever we want. If that choice is our own and not someone else's, should people, whose decision it was not, try to change your mind about it?

3. Overall, I find we all need to be a bit more open. Too many people hide behind false beliefs and prejudice to protect themselves from something that is not at all dangerous.

I myself, have not made my descision about what I want to do, who I want to be, or where I want to end up. But when I do, I don't want anyone to try and change it for me.
Let me make my own msitakes.

[Berlin]

@ x_lilmissNINJA_x

1. If you would take a look at the Bible. It does work with today's standards. I try to live by it as much as possible and I function much better in society than many who do not consider it at all.

2. Would you not try to help someone who is addicted to cocaine and cannot see it is a problem?

3. Is befriending those I do not agree with not open? This point contradicts your 2nd point. You are trying to tell we need to be open to others and let us change our opinions but we should not listen to others and stick to what we know.

By all means, make your own mistakes. But don't bite at a hand trying to help you back up.

[x_lilmissNINJA_x]

@Berlin Hawk

okay, so, I have never been good at explaining myself. That is pretty clear. xP

[Berlin]

Sorry. I can get kinda... eh.. in these discussions.

I also felt somewhat attacked my your first point. It wasn't intentionally. But I completely disagree with it.

[x_lilmissNINJA_x]

yeah.
People are always entitled to their opinions, so I don't mind.
I have the same bad habit of attacking other peoples ideas, anyways.
so i know how it is.
xP

[Weaseldale]

1. Your're right, the Bible does fit todays standards, but most people do not change their opinion as the world does, so it's hard to tell.

2. You can only help people who want to be helped, and if you use cocaine then you know that why and how what you're doing is wrong, because it does obvious damage to people. What damage does being gay do to you?

3. Befriending those you don't agree with just to try and change them is twisted and the person on the opposite side often feels like they have been betrayed and lied to. How would you feel if you knew that someone only wanted to be your friend because they wanted to try and make you Atheist?

Just to go further into this discussion. Debates like this help me get closer to people.

[x_lilmissNINJA_x]

(Can I get off topic for a moment?
Weasel, look! *pokes siggy* xD i made that in like, half an hour. xP)

@weaseldale point 2
People being gay hurts no one, and thats the point. The only reason people complain about it is because they have their heads shoved too far up their butts to care about anything but the stupidest topics.

@ weaseldales point 3

I hate people like that
who only befriend you to force you to be different.
It's horrible and frankly rude and twsisted.
I stay with the friends who don't try to change me or others.

[Berlin]

Many people don't realize what they do to their bodies is bad. Just getting that one out there. It's sadly true.

As I said above, I find homosexuality to be a sin. Just as drugs can be bad mentally and physically, sin hurts you spiritually.

Also. I got that part out wrong. But when I befriend someone, there are defiantly more reasons. If I can see that they are struggling with sin, it makes me want to help them more. I just feel a strong need to help those that could be harming themselves. Whether it's mental, physical, emotional, or spiritual.

If someone wants to convert me to Atheism, I'd probably listen to what they had to say and then explain my own situation. I get where you were coming from with that. It came out wrong which is typical of me.

I'm super bad at expressing myself. XDD

[x_lilmissNINJA_x]

Eh.
I am too.
So dun worry about it.

[Rawien]

Sorry, quite late reply to berlinhawk.

But it is discrimination, you're pointing out that there is something fundamentally wrong with a person, because what they're doing is something that is fundamental to them. Being gay isn't a choice, much like you won't think your religion is a choice. I always found it strange when learning about history when I was younger. When people talked about the prosecution of the Jews I didn't understand why they wouldn't just pretend not to be Jewish for a bit, pretend they renounced their faith. Or even renounce it all together. But as I grew older I began to realise that there are some things in life that aren't a choice.

I honestly don't mean to be insulting, but I find the forcing of help in the way you're describing on people who chose same sex relationships to be almost arrogant...It's not affecting you. Even if you do believe it's a sin, I just can't see how it's evil. I can understand wanting to help people with alcohol problems, drug problems, eating problems or people who steal, or gamble or murder or even smoke too heavily but homosexuality is just an act of love to someone else.

I agree with you, I'm straight and I love alot of my female friends dearly, and yet wouldn't want to kiss them. But if someone else did...So? You'd kiss a boy? I don't understand what's the horrific difference?

And no...I wouldn't make love to a cat either hahahah.

[Afanassii]