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Post new topic   Reply to topic Teenage Infantilization
Chu
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 PostPosted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 9:20 pm Reply with quote        
Most teenagers suffer from what some call teenage infantilization, which is exactly as it sounds. It's the act of treating a teenager as you would a child. They have the intelligence and capabilities of adults, but you still treat them like they can barely even feed themselves. According to this article, adolescence is merely an artificial extension of childhood. The only reason it exists if because of adults that merely believe that teenagers can't take care of themselves when they obviously can. The article claims that it's because of this that teenagers act so stupidly. (My words.) Imagine being treated like a child, despite how you are right now. Apparently, the psychological effects of being treated with such little respect aren't that hard to understand: If you're treated like an idiot, you'll behave like an idiot. Mom and dad say you're not responsible, so you're not.


Please, read the article, and offer your opinion on the subject. (Not my situation - it was just an example to show that not all teenagers behave that way.) Also, I'm not looking to argue whether the article is right or wrong. I realize that it's not entirely reliable. However, I think that it brings up a good point that should be discussed.


EDITED to focus more on the topic at hand.


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 PostPosted: Wed Jul 14, 2010 4:29 am Reply with quote        
Well, I think the constant overflow of hormones and the fact that their brain isn't fully developed until their mid-twenties also have something to do with it Roll Eyes

But yeah, I agree that teenagers should be able to have some responsibilites, and that they should be trusted to be able to take care of themselves in certain situations. If they prove they can't, THEN they can lose those rights.
That's how my dad did it with me. He made me responsible for my own curfew and homework and being home alone, and if I couln't get up to get to school on time, or if I didn't do my homework because I played computergames, or if the house looked like a wreck when he got back, he'd take those privileges away for a little while.


One thing that bugs me about parenting is when people ground their kids and teenagers.
It is not a good punishment and does not teach them the consequences of their actions; it teaches them that it's a punishment to be at home, something that, in my opninon, might lead to missing more curfews and staying out longer, and in general more rebelling.

My parents only grounded me once, for half an hour, but that was because I literaly begged to be grounded to see what it was all about, since the other kids kept getting it Sweat

(Ps: the Norwegian word for 'being grounded' actually translates directly to "House-arrest" go figure )
Overlord Branny



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 PostPosted: Wed Jul 14, 2010 4:39 am Reply with quote        
Some teenagers are responsible and ALOT are not..

That's all I have to say about that.. *Forest Gump voice*

I don't really trust teenagers...since I already lived through those years and I know just how stupid they can be. Sure, some responsibility is good but..not too much....
Most teenagers I knew/know would probably do something really stupid...

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 PostPosted: Wed Jul 14, 2010 8:07 am Reply with quote        
On The grounding thing I was grounded but it was more of you can go outside and play but you can't play your video games no riding your bike and no going up to your friends house but you can play in the front yard and use your imagination.


Of course I was given responsibility's early on in life, so I was never treated to much like a child as a teenager. I was expected to clean up my room and sometimes the house. If I didn't then I got a talking to and a no you can't go to that party after work your coming home and doing your homework if you haven't done it and if you have then your just coming home and going to bed.

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 PostPosted: Thu Jul 15, 2010 4:16 am Reply with quote        
I think it is also important to remember that eenagers are, in fact, kind of still children.
Especially the ages 13-18 are very crucial, because their brain is growing at a high speed, and the hormones are flowing as well as they are experimenting with love and sex and alcohol and god knows what.
The feeling of wanting to be independent gets higher every year, but they're still impulsive and inexperienced. Teenagers are impulsive, are not very good at evaluating themselves, the part of their brain that has a deeper understanding of consequences is still under-developed, and they think they know much better than anyone who begs to differ.
I've met many 17-year-olds who've claimed to be all grown up and to know what's best for themselves, when they clearly haven't.
Teenagers should still be given some restricions by their parents, in my opinion, as they are still learning, and could use a guiding hand to teach them (sometimes with tough love!) how the world works, and help them keep a healthy sleep-pattern. (And to stay in school and not be druggie hoebags!)
Restriction does not mean being treated like a child, I think, and I'm glad my parents had some boundaries for me (although I was, of course, furious at the time, I can see now why they did it, and I feel sorry for the kids whose parents didn't.)
Athilea Majiri



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 PostPosted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 9:53 pm Reply with quote        
Okay, I'm not trying to start a fight. However, I think that guy is an idiot. He states that other mammals treat their adolescents as adults. Does he honestly think that our 11 and 12 year olds need to go out, get married and have children? We went through that stage of life already, when out life expectancy was much shorter. That is why animals do it, because they have much shorter lives than we do.

Think about it this way, we use to live only to about...30 maybe 40 if we were lucky. The really old ones that made it to 50 or 60 were VERY rare. Now we normally live to 70 and 80 years old. Longer sometimes. And out life expectancy is every increasing. Is he saying that we need teenagers out there popping out children and fighting for jobs like the rest of us?

Yes, I'm using the term children often because you still are a child until you reach the age of 18. Once you are 18 you are free to make your own decisions and to get a job and so on and so forth.

For us to do what this guy is hinting at would require a complete and total overall of the way that we raise children in such a way that I don't even know where to start. That being said, I suppose you COULD raise a child to be responsible by the time they were 15, but it would not give them a lot of time to just be a kid and have fun.
Chu
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 PostPosted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 11:50 pm Reply with quote        
I disagree. People will act according to how they're treated, and most people treat teenagers like imbeciles. People in general tend to only live up to their expectations, if they reach them at all. Teenagers know that no one has high expectations for them in the first place. They know that no one cares if they act like idiots or make mistakes because they'll just be marked off as another troublesome kid. Without the responsibilities of adulthood lingering down, they act with absolutely no responsibilities at all.

Teenagers don't need to be taught anything, and they don't need specialized restrictions laid down for them. They are just as competent as adults, yet treated like children. I don't think that many of you understand the dangers of this system.


@Nova: “Stay in school, sleep regularly, don't be a dirty hoebag!” Would any adult take someone seriously if they were told that? They’d respond with, "I can make my own decisions; I'm an adult." Correct? That's exactly how teenagers think as well. They’re completely capable of those things, yet adults feel the need to constantly breathe down their necks to “remind” them to behave well. It’s completely insulting to any shred of independence that they have.


@Majiri: Like I said, I'm not interested in debating about the article itself because I caught his fallacies too. I'm interested in the topic itself, but that article triggered the thought in my mind so I figured that I should share it.

I don't like the concept of letting kids enjoy childhood while they can. I consider it a cop out for the laziness that many people today attribute themselves to. There's nothing wrong with enjoying childhood, but at a certain point it does end and you should begin taking on more responsibilities. To elongate that point in one’s life only tells them that they have the luxury of slacking off more and more. Eventually, you get to a point where you can’t turn back. They’ll continue expecting the world to hand everything to them on a silver platter.


I don't want to get into a heated debate here - I just felt the need to elaborate my point. I respect any differing opinions to mine.


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 PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2010 1:09 am Reply with quote        
I had a biology teacher say it best
"like it or not teenagers got us thousands of years"
Meaning that because 30 used to be "old" teen's are able to survive regardless of what society says it wasn't untill the last few hundred years elderly people even begain showing up.

Athilea Majiri



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 PostPosted: Mon Jul 19, 2010 6:28 pm Reply with quote        
I have to say that I don't agree with that. Very few people even in their 20's bother to act responsibly when they DO have the pressures of adult hood on them. I mean, I know a woman who now has two children that are toddler age and younger. You know what she talks about? Drinking and partying. How can we possibly thing that our teenagers would act differently? They are still children and should be treated with more respect then a 10 year old, and have responsibilities around the house, but they should not be thrown onto the streets and forced to find work. I know that's not literally what would be happening, but you know what I mean.

I just don't see how anyone could think that this would be a good idea. Until you have reached the age of 18 then you should not be living on your own and trying to support yourself. Sure, there are some kids that have managed it because they did not have a choice. Ask them if they wish things were different? Ask them if they wish they had not been forced into adult hood so soon.

I have lived through experiences at VERY young ages that forced me to make adult decisions. I wish I could have avoided it. I wish that things had been different. I am not saying that kids should remain kids until they are 18 because I don't know what I'm talking about. I am saying it because I know what it feels like to be made to grow up to soon. It's not fun, it's not something that a teenager should WANT. If you are a teenager and reading this, then please do not try to grow up to soon.

Hell, I know a lot of people that got married and had children before they graduated it. They don't regret their families, but they regret the fact that they did not wait. Do you want that to be you?

As far as not being heated, it's hard for me not to get passionate in discussions like this. You believe as you will, and I believe as I will. I don't think things will change.

And to Shwing, the reason that was done is because our species did not have a choice until recently. You give any other mammal a chance and they will react similarly to the way we do. If you do not have to risk it, then you will give your children more time to learn. Maybe I am so passionate about this because I have a child, but I remember what it was like being a teenager as well.

Treat teenagers with respect, but do not treat them as you would an adult. Expect them to behave properly, but guide them. Punish them if applicable. If they do something REALLY stupid, then they will still go to jail. Teenagers are still held accountable for their actions, and that will not change. I do not agree that they are brushed off unless their family is rich. In that case they do expect everything to be handed to them 99.9 percent of the time. And they aren't well adjusted.

Anyway...I am ranting. I will stop.
Chu
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 PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:45 pm Reply with quote        
Different people lead different lives, so I don't see how your example proves a point one way or the other. And I'm not really proposing anything here other than for people to take teenagers (young adults) more seriously and stop babying them. I'm not saying that they should live on their own, just that they have the capabilities to do so. XD

Erm, I'm seventeen, and I've been put through a lot too. I've been forced to make plenty of adult decisions, and I'm glad that my childhood wasn't exactly fun-loving and innocent. I wouldn't have wanted to grow up any other way because I feel that without those life lessons I'd be another stupid girl running around with no idea of where she wants to go in life. I have gone through depressing times in my life, and I've even been suicidal because of it, but it all made me stronger. I wouldn't change any of it for the world. Different people treat things differently.

Everyone lives with regrets in their lives, one way or another. I can grantee that I won't be in that situation because, again, everyone is different. I may have similar regrets in the future, but that possibility doesn't bother me. In fact, I know that I'll have severe regrets one way or another with my current options (having a family vs. teaching in Japan) but everyone has to make a choice at some point. If I avoided those situations, I'd never get anywhere, would I? ^^ Please, don't feel the need to lecture me. Part of my entire point is that people, including teenagers, should be allowed to fall flat on their faces, deep into holes that they dug for themselves, and learn from those mistakes. They’re not as weak as their parents would like to think.

And on the heated note, that's fine. I just made that comment to be clear that I'm not trying to force my opinions on anyone. xP I tend to come across as harsh and overbearing sometimes and want to avoid that here.

You seem to have a strong and well-defined moral fiber, but mine is very, very different from yours. My views of the world and society are very harsh. Everything is dependent on the individual, rather than the group. That's probably why we have such differing opinions.


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 PostPosted: Sun Aug 01, 2010 1:39 pm Reply with quote        
Personally I sort of seem to straddle the line between "they are children still" and "they are adults"
I recently had my mother and stepdad move out, leaving myself, my husband, and my 16 year old brother living in this house. Incredibly long story as to why, but the point is, my mother had a very overbearing parenting style. She would ask my brother to do a chore, say unload and load the dishwasher, in the morning. She would then nag at him constantly until it was done. Often, he would end up not doing the chore, mostly out of spite, because every fifteen minutes it was "have you done your chores yet?" and even I found it obnoxious and she wasn't even speaking to me!

My husband and I laid down these ground rules when the parents moved out: You are essentially paying rent here (mom sends him a sizeable check, part of which goes to us for his share of rent and food and such, the rest he spends as he pleases) so you will overall be treated as a room mate. You will do your own laundry. You will wash the pots and pans you use to cook. You will pick up after yourself in the common areas. You will keep your room mildly clean-ish, so as not to attract ants, roaches, mice, etc. Otherwise your room is your room. UNLIKE a room-mate, if you do not clean up after yourself, there will be repercussions such as me shutting the internet off to your x-box, your computer, your PSP, etc, or you will not be allowed to visit friends, or go to an event you wished to go to. He agreed, and thus far under these rules he's been doing excellently.
I do occasionally have to go behind him and say "hey, you need to take care of xyz thing or I'll have to cut off your internet" and he'll get it done, but I have yet to ACTUALLY cut off the internet or punish him..
He really seems to take well to this mostly responsible for yourself with some gentle nudging method...
Chu
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 PostPosted: Sun Aug 01, 2010 1:52 pm Reply with quote        
That's the perfect way of handling it, honestly. Teenagers don't do well with someone constantly breathing down their necks - it gives the impression that they're not trusted, thus not expected to do anything.

One thing I've realized is that many parents try to raise their children with threats. That's... not gonna work, mainly because many of those threats are empty. Once you set up that idea that you're just bluffing to get the chore done, the kid will start thinking that all instances will be like that. Whenever they stop doing what they're asked and are punished for it, it's "unfair" because they hadn't been punished the first time. Once a rule is set up, it needs to be enforced every time to ensure that the child understands that it's more than a threat.

That's honestly the way that everyone behaves - not just children. Sure, we have enough pride to deny it, and there are always exceptions with adults and children alike, but you can't deny that that system will work for most individuals, regardless of age.


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 PostPosted: Sun Aug 01, 2010 2:10 pm Reply with quote        
The "empty threat" thing is another reason why my husband and I carefully chose the punishments that we did. My mom never had a hard line of when we were to be punished, and therefore we rarely were. She would just constantly nag and threaten and nothing would happen, and then one day she would snap and scream at everybody and throw us all out of the house and clean it all herself..

The hard line with us is that if the dish/trash sits for two days, there is a punishment. Usually after a day I will administer a nudge of 'hey you know your noodle pot is still on the counter?' or whatever it is.. and he will take care of it.
However if it ever came to the point that we needed to punish, our punishments are usually pretty exact, always incredibly easy to administer and control, and not something I'd be tempted to back down on. Usually the loss of internet is the first thing, and since I have easy access to the parental controls on the router itself, I can easily and quickly block all of his gadgets and things that use the wifi, and deny them access for x amount of time, which will automatically go away when the punishment is over, and I don't even have to think about it.
Chu
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 PostPosted: Sun Aug 01, 2010 2:19 pm Reply with quote        
That's another thing that a lot of parents do. DX They'll nag about something and end up doing it themselves. What did that even do?! You know it's just going to happen again! My brother and sister always leave coke cans and food wrappers everywhere and even though my mom nags about it, who do you think ends up cleaning? Her. How long does it take for that mess to come back? About a day.

You have better parenting methods than most parents. XDD That's sad.


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 PostPosted: Sun Aug 01, 2010 5:45 pm Reply with quote        
I think part of the reason I'm such a good "parent" is because I've had lots of perspective on various parenting styles, and the results.. I have one friend whose mom was so super strict, like crazy strict.. she's now the sluttiest person I know personally.
I have another friend whose mom took the "I'm your best friend more than I'm your parent" and did very little actual parenting, and I've seen how that friend turned out, too..
My mom took the "nag but no follow up" approach, and my cousin has a mom who just.. punished with no warning or solid rules, just all of a sudden this is wrong and you're in trouble.. That pretty much covers the spectrum IMO..
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