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Post new topic   Reply to topic Should you teach your kids that we're all equal?
Chu
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 PostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2013 3:18 pm Reply with quote        
Most people would immediately say yes. But, I'm here to say no.

Obviously I need to explain myself. I'll start by examining equality. There seem to be two definitions of equality floating around these days. One is that all groups or people have the same rights, privileges, and opportunities. Another is that all groups or people have the same makeup: they all have the potential for good or bad, and nothing makes them innately superior or inferior to any other groups or people. So, basically it boils down to how you're treated, or how you're born. Fairly simple stuff.

I want to tell you that I am working under the assumption that inequality is prevalent in modern society. If you want to debate that subject in particular, or if you want to discuss the validity of social movements, then please make another thread. I don't want to derail this topic. This topic is about how we should raise our kids, given that inequality exists. It's about what we should teach them, and how we should do it. It's also about how these lessons can affect our kids in the future.

I also want to clarify one thing: as in all philosophical discussions, or subjects on social issues, your personal experiences mean nothing. Your beliefs matter, of course, but due to the broad scope of this subject, I am not looking for personal experiences. When I say "we do __" I'm talking about people on the whole. Society. Don't refute with, "No, I don't do that!" If you personally experienced something that opposes any of the arguments made in this thread, then I request that you do some research and think critically: are you cherry-picking, or are you offering a reasonable argument?

Now that I've made the foundation for this discussion, I'll move on to my opinion: we should not teach our kids that everyone is equal. This certainly doesn't mean that I think we should teach our kids that certain people are better than others. No, instead, I think that we should teach our kids that certain groups are treated better than others. At this point, you my think, "But you're still teaching your kids that all people are equal, right?" Not exactly. Why? Well, basically, I think that teaching our kids that everyone is equal can set them up for bigoted beliefs and behavior in the future. I also think that this mindset is lazy, but I'll get into that later.

I'm probably not making much sense. Teaching your kids that everyone is equal is the opposite of bigotry. But, what I think most people fail to realize is that, psychologically, we hold onto this idea of equality more tightly than we realize. When we fall into this mindset of "everyone's the same" then we truly believe it - even when other groups or individuals are treated unfairly. We believe that we all have the same opportunities because, hey, we all bleed red! What I'm starting to touch on here is called The Just World Theory. (I recommend that you read the full thing. It's very insightful, and not very long.) It basically proposes that we typically see victims of misfortune as deserving of what happens to them. This is where people are coming from when they say rape victims "were asking for it" or when black victims of violence "looked suspicious."

We see this crime committed against an individual, and the first thing we think is, "Well, what could they have done to deserve it?" Why? Because we desperately want - no, we need - to see the world as a just and predictable place. The good are rewarded and the bad are punished. That also works inversely: good things happen to good people, and bad things happen to bad people. But what happens when bad things happen to good people? Your belief is contradicted with opposing evidence, so you must either change the belief, or rationalize the evidence in a way that it fits your belief. (This process is a part of cognitive dissonance. You can look that up on your own.)

She was asking for it. He looked suspicious. It's much easier to rationalize contradictory evidence than it is to change a long-held belief. It would take something particularly jarring, like an injustice committed against you or someone you love, or an unbelievably atrocious event, in order for that belief to change.

I'll take a few steps forward here to push this post along. What I'm getting at is this: when you focus on the idea that all people are equal, you set yourself up for the just world fallacy. Teaching your kids that all people are equal (that the world is just) can lead them to this dangerous moral trap. Rather, I think that we should teach our children about the injustices that innocent people face. Of course, we should maintain that all people and groups should be treated equally, but that should not be the focus. Instead, the focus should be on how the world is unjust, and how those people aren't treated equally even though they deserve to be.


Minor points I want to address:
The reason that I believe that "all people are equal" is a lazy belief is because it neglects to acknowledge the inequality that certain people face in our society. It's like saying "I'm color-blind" or "we're all the same on the inside." These sugared, simplistic, feel-good quotes do nothing to examine exactly why, despite whatever beliefs people hold, minorities exist, and why they face prejudice. I suppose that in essence, I think that "we're all equal" should go without saying anyway. When someone approaches me with a phrase like this, I understand it as, "Well, I'm not the one hurting this minority, so I'm not going to acknowledge their plight." And, in my mind, apathy of the privileged contributes to the oppression of the unprivileged. If you want to discuss this at length, please quote this section of my post and make another thread.

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 PostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2013 3:55 pm Reply with quote        
This is a very complicated question and takes delicate care in deciding an answer. The article you included in your reasoning, Chu, helped push my mind even more than just your explanation itself, which had my mind reeling and pondering for quite some time. Before I answer, I'd like to thank you again for expressing it, and making me think about something in a way I don't usually.

After long consideration, I'm going to have to agree with your answer. Teaching our children that everyone is equal is lying to them. True equality at this point is just a myth, in a way. It is true we should teach them that all should be treated as equals, but saying they are is just going to confuse and cause trouble. It sugar coats the reality to a degree that just perpetuates the problem. So...

We shouldn't teach them that we are. Not yet. We should teach them that we should be equal, and that hopefully one day we will be truly equal. But we aren't yet equal. The children deserve to know this truth, even if the truth is painful.

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 PostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2013 4:00 pm Reply with quote        
I agree with June, to a point. I believe that we should still teach our children that everyone is equal, and that they should be treated as such. Not the basic blanket 'all are equal' statement, but teahing them that too many people believe differently, disagree, and treat people as if they're not equal and that that is wrong. Tell them how it is, and how it should be, in the hopes that they will grow up to change the world for the better with more equality.
Strix Varia



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 PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2013 11:19 pm Reply with quote        
It is easy to forget the full quote of men being equal. Thomas Jefferson was credited with quoting "We hold these truths to be self-evident: that all men are created equal; that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights; that among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness." This means that even though we are not all perfect clones of each other, our rights under the law are the same.

The article you mentioned basically details that people use profiling to make themselves more comfortable with the world even when there is no bases for the profile. We all like to think that we understand the world but we can only understand what we have been taught by others or by self experience. In your personal rules of debate you said that "Your personal experiences mean nothing" But that is exactly how we learn to profile. If five different red-haired freckle-faced women came up to you on the sidewalk, spit in your face and slapped you then you would probably be very cautious when the next red-haired freckle-faced women walked up to you on the sidewalk. Profiling is a survival instinct. Profiling is what gives you a 'Bad Feeling' when something doesn't look right. If someone in an alley shows you a gun and then asks you to give them money, it is NOT unreasonable to presume that they are trying to rob you and will shoot you if you don't. That is profiling gun owners. That could just be a random beggar who is proud of his gun.

Profiling has become a dirty word in our society but it is often based on very real numbers and averages. Tall people TEND to make better basketball players. Red haired people TEND to sunburn easily. Women TEND to be more emotional once a month. Of course we are all different. That is how we have people to do all the jobs that need doing. People have different skill sets, different tastes, different desires, and different ways of seeing the world.

So no, do not try to convince your children that we are all just clones of each other. But do try to point out that despite our differences, we all born with the same rights, obligations, and representations under the law.
Weiss



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 PostPosted: Tue May 26, 2015 10:50 am Reply with quote        
At first I didn't get what you were saying but soon I was able to see where you were coming from.

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